Caribbean Culinary Art and Culture

Speaker 1 0:03

Everyone , welcome to another episode of Carry On Friends , the Caribbean American podcast . I'm excited because my guest today is Wesley-Jean Simon Wesley . welcome to the podcast . How are you ?

Speaker 2 0:14

I'm good . How are you doing ?

Speaker 1 0:16

I am doing wonderful . So why don't you tell the community of friends a little bit about who you are , caribbean country you represent and the work that you do ?

Speaker 2 0:26

Well , my name is Wesley-Jean Simon . I'm Jean Simon with you , from the French Caribbean . I represent the Haitian community in culinary art in Brooklyn , new York . So I'm currently on Selmy restaurant here in Brooklyn on North Shrine Avenue and in Soho on Spring Street , and we just opened a brewery with crafted pizza in Brooklyn , again on North Shrine Avenue again . So we try to grow more in the community and present more Caribbean food , better culture , better food , better life .

Speaker 1 0:56

All right . So what was the last place you opened ? a pizza .

Speaker 2 1:01

It's a brewery and pizza , so we brew our own beer in the neighborhood . Yes , and we do crafted pizzas . So we try to accommodate the community . Like you know , we do a chicken pizza , we'll do a hair and pizza , we'll do a pinot pizza and a gruyo pizza . So we try to represent all the culture in the Caribbean and give them something on the pizza .

Speaker 1 1:23

That is amazing . All right , so before we get into that right , tell me about what life was like for you growing up in a very Caribbean Haitian family community and what led you to get into the culinary arts .

Speaker 2 1:41

Well , i basically grew up in a big Caribbean culture in Jersey , so I went to high school in Jersey and I moved to Brooklyn about 15 years ago . My biggest influence is just that I like culture , i love culture . I'm from Haiti , you know . It's all music , song and dance and we all always been a happy people .

Speaker 2 1:59

And moving to Brooklyn , i used to live in Crown Heights in a more of a Jewish neighborhood , so I felt uncomfortable . Whenever I walk outside , i couldn't find nothing to eat And I wanted to live in a better community where I can walk outside , speak queer or speak some type of patois and enjoy my people and my culture . Because , after being in college , being in Jersey , living amongst everybody else , i wanted to come home . So I decided to move to Flatbush about seven years ago . So , when I walk outside my door , there's jerk chicken , there's different type of roti , there's , like you know , haitian beef patty , there's Jamaican beef patty . So on my way to work as an executive sous chef for Hard Rock Cafe , i had to grab something to eat on my way to work And I wanted to eat my culture before I indulge into everybody else's culture's food . So that's the reason why I love my Caribbean people and I love my neighborhood And I wanted to basically open my restaurant in my neighborhood so I could let them taste a part of my culture .

Speaker 1 3:02

You know I am so excited for you and excited that you are on this podcast , because , as we get more globalized and everyone is getting to know our culture , on one hand this is part of the work you do right You're creating meals for us , but you also want people outside our culture to experience our food . So how do you balance the authenticity of our culture with sharing that culture with the world ? How do you balance that ?

Speaker 2 3:32

But let's just dig into jerk chicken , right ? You know , if you go to Jamaica you could get a jerk chicken sandwich .

Speaker 1 3:38

I know that .

Speaker 2 3:39

So just picture if we could get a jerk chicken sandwich . What is a pizza ? It's a dough . You know you got to get a closed bread , like you know got to open tenders so you can actually paint anything you want on that tenders . So I don't take away from the jerk , i do not take away from the meat itself or the taste or the seasoning . I give you the same thing . But you know you just sit it on the pizza with cheese . If you want to get cheese , you want the cheese . You want the red sauce , you don't want the red sauce . You want it with white sauce , you get it with white sauce . But you still get that same taste of jerk when you bite into the pizza You feel like you're eating jerk on a pizza . So I did not take away nothing .

Speaker 1 4:14

Well , it's not so much for you non Caribbean folks when they do things of the culture , like you know , even Haitian dishes , like real , like how , how we expand folks to enjoy , or cuisine , but not necessarily . I don't know what's the word , because I see it all the time on the internet and I know you've seen it where people complain .

Speaker 2 4:38

I can tell you all about it . Like you know , i have an Instagram and I had a few videos that's been going viral . So when you reach a million view , that's when you start seeing , like the people coming out of the woodwork . Like you know , we posted something about , like you know , a Haitian spaghetti which starts , like you know , with hot dogs . we do ours hot dog deep fried first , then we take it out of the oil , then we put it in a red sauce , then we do it with spaghetti and everything . This video got 1.7 million view And now you see everybody coming out of the woodwork Oh , haitians , don't make this , haitians , don't make that .

Speaker 2 5:10

This is Italian and you've got people all the way in Italy It's like commanding ordinary talking about , oh , italian . then you got the other part of the island talking about Italian and the pastor You guys claim pastor . the Chinese have been pastor . So basically , what I always tell people about food there's no new meat under the earth unless we haven't discovered it's gotta be under the ocean . There's no new rice , no new wheat , no new bread you inventing or anything . Food is belong to the humanity . So if I'm a Haitian , i wanna develop something better and feed my people and introduce them to something new . I'm not breaking away from the culture . I'm not doing nothing but a culture , but enticing them to try a different culture , the one that doesn't travel to see different culture , but make them feel it in a comfortable space . So if I'm doing pizza , just picture from Haiti I'm doing pizza . pizza is not from Haiti , that's not that in a pizza shop in Haiti . But if I wanna put the grillo on top of the pizza , so I'm making you feel welcome , so you could have that grillo taste on top of something new , so I'm introducing that to my culture .

Speaker 2 6:15

I read an article about three months ago and ranking in food in the world , like which country is number one , number two , number three Haitians actually came out to number 58 . And our food is great . the whole Caribbean knows we got great food . The whole Korean knows Jamaican banging on food . But when you see those ratings , because the rest of the world don't know our food , so they don't know how to grade us , so there's no way you're gonna tell me the French can cook better than us . They don't grow nothing in France . We all know that . they do not grow anything in France . This is why I mean I'm not attacking the French .

Speaker 1 6:51

No , no , no , no . But that's . You touch on something that I literally wrote down here , where I've heard it been said many times that Caribbean food doesn't plate well because that's how they're ranking it presentation , and I don't think that's true . Not forget , i don't think that's true , i know that's not true . So what do you say to critics who say , well , of course , caribbean food , haitian food , jamaican Trini , whatever food , it's messy , it doesn't plate well . What's your response to that ?

Speaker 2 7:21

Well , it's how you take it . Like you , let's just say , right , a chef that's well trained , being the culinary school , you can present the meat however you want on a plate and make it look the way you wanna make it , but the essence of the food you cannot take away from it , the taste , the culture you cannot take away from it . But when you're looking at , like you know those , like you know high end chef , how to plate food , the food don't look like it came from any country , it's just a picture on a plate . So that's why they're saying it doesn't plate . Well , it's because they're repainting the picture on a plate but they're not taking away the taste from the plate . So when there's the Caribbean , food don't taste well . I have a picture in my phone that I don't share with people My take on grill .

Celebrating Caribbean Culture Through Food

Speaker 2 8:02

I did a eight ounce piece of , like you know , pork shoulder . I asked to be like I boil it down , make it like , do all the steps with it . Then I cut it down to size , make it look like a block . Then I deep fry at 500 degrees So you can get like a nice crisp around it . Then I sit in on a bed of sauce with the glaze on it . Then I use the plantain , i mash the plantain , i did some of that design with it , but a Haitian looking at it they'll be like , oh , that's not grill , cause it's not small pieces , but when you taste it it tastes exactly like grill . So it's how you present it on a plate .

Speaker 2 8:36

So the day before yesterday I was the judge of the Bobby Flay . We got to release it next winter And what they were doing they were doing jerk chicken . So Bobby Flay was doing jerk chicken And another chef from Florida that have a food stand was doing jerk chicken and the guy is white And he loved Caribbean food . He loved the people around it And what he did ? he married the jerk chicken with Picles , the Haitian Picles cabbage , and he presented and he beat Bobby Flay with it .

Speaker 1 9:07

I could see how that works .

Speaker 2 9:09

But think about it . He beat Bobby Flay with it and he presented a certain way on a plate And I was one of the judges . I was shocked , Like when I walked into the stage , two white guy competing about jerk chicken . So how can you say you got a top chef like Bobby Flay Flating jerk chicken and he said Caribbean food don't play well , Why is it doing on a shelf ?

Speaker 2 9:30

So it's just that stigma that people got in the back of their head , Cause most of our Caribbean food , cause the island is so hot , we don't do that much restaurant . Everything we do is outdoor . You hang out , So all the food basically become more street food than like in restaurant food , Cause we our door people , we under the sun people . So when people talking like that , when you came from Haiti , we know , with the hardship of the war , what's going on in Haiti now there's barely any restaurant , There's no movie theater , There's no culinary arts restaurants And people can lose that sense of like . You know we can do this . Well , My job in this community is to represent my culture and be like hey , we can do this too . We can turn a picture . Don't get it messed up .

Speaker 1 10:15

I feel the same way . It's like you remember the commercial Anything you can do , i can do better . Yeah , that's how I feel . I feel like we rise to the occasion . That's the culture of what we come from collectively . You know that We can do this . It's amazing , it's beautiful . You know , like I remember years ago there was a discussion friends and I were having that the concept of combining cocoa and milk to make hot chocolate was discovered in Jamaica , and so and people are like , no , that's not true . And the story behind it was that the enslavers , they couldn't stomach the cocoa , so the slaves , they added milk to kind of ease the flavor , and that's how it got exported and became hot chocolate . And it's almost as if the conversation is like a little place like that couldn't have made such a discovery .

Speaker 2 11:10

I think it's not even white folks . You know , in my position right now and what I'm doing , i can only mess my own thing up . I don't think nobody else can mess it up with me , so it's not like white folks . Thinking about our food is this it doesn't play well , it's our own people . That's actually lacking the way we played our own food .

Speaker 1 11:28

I agree . I agree because we don't always support , and I think it's the idea of what we see put out and what we are comparing our food to , but we just know that it tastes good . So it's this idea of it doesn't feel refined and sophisticated and we complain about it .

Speaker 2 11:48

If you're looking at the Italians , the French , the Spaniards , the German , they did not create no culinary art at all . That's still in Poma del Canto . So whatever they bring into their table to their house , it's coming from our culture , it's coming from Egypt , it's coming from Africa , it's coming from the Caribbean . Even Rum . They all try to claim Rum desktop . Whatever Rum wasn't created , it was in the islands . And you know , certain things like beer wasn't created in , like Germany , the way they act like it was created , it wasn't .

Speaker 2 12:17

So a lot of people don't even understand . We lost the essence of who we are , and I'm the biggest African black . I'm talking about 1804 , when it's come down to Haitian people , we are now . We need to do better . We need to stand up and stop dwelling on the past . Let's move forward and show them who we were and who we are now . But our own people is not knocking the food , knocking the drinks , knocking the culture . Oh , why do you wear bright colors ? It's in our culture . We invented Marigua , not New Orleans , you know . So the Caribbean invented so much and we bought culture too , like the funerals in New Orleans . It started back in Haiti , in Jamaica . We celebrate our people . So when you're looking at 1804 , it started with Jamaica . When I tell people 1804 started with Jamaica , that was like I said that Haiti was the first week . I was like bookman from Jamaica Stop . The father of the revolution is from Jamaica . So the only problem we have with the Jamaican in Haitian is a both stop away .

Speaker 1 13:22

We're all cousins dropped off at little islands and that's it . But Like you live in Flatbush , i live in East Flatbush , exactly exactly . You know what I love about just this conversation with you . I really didn't even expect it to go this way and I think it's this mutual love for culture and or cultural expressions and you know , food is just one of those things , because we love food as a culture . It's the kitchen , the fireside , every occasion we have , what do we do Cook , what do we do Eat You ?

Speaker 2 13:54

don't go to a Caribbean person without getting some food .

Speaker 1 13:56

Exactly , exactly . So what do you think ? I guess food is like you said it's a universal language , but what specifically makes it extra special , as we are in the fusion of what's Brooklyn and bringing all of these cultures together , what makes it even so much more yummy and dynamic and interesting and communal with all of these flavors coming together ? What is your perspective ?

Speaker 2 14:22

When you come down with flavors . you know we invented flavor in the islands . We brought flavor to America . But let's go further . Christopher Columbus did not discover America , it came to the island . So what he was looking for ? spice . So when we do our food we put spice . It's not spicy , we got blends of spice . When you do that jerk spice , you know how many seasonings you put in a jerk spice to get that flavor . No way around the world can come up with that type of combination and make it work .

Speaker 1 14:53

And you know why they did it . It was for the very basic thing It was for meat preservation . That's really the original intent of it . So out of all of that , it's the ingenuity of it . We give the world flavor .

Speaker 2 15:07

So when we brought the flavor from the Caribbean , we brought it to Brooklyn . We brought it to a place like Florida and , like you know , Caribbean community . in Boston or Atlanta We actually feeding more people right now per capita when somebody wants some good food , when they say good food , they're not running to my hat , no more . That's what I'm witnessing in Brooklyn right now . They're not running to my hat , They're coming to Brooklyn . So Brooklyn is , like you know , becoming a flavor hub for all things .

Speaker 1 15:36

Caribbean . Listen , i was just talking to a colleague and I was talking about how , many years ago , how it was a diss to say , oh , they're Bridgettonal people because they weren't from Manhattan , and now it's cool to be Bridgettonal , right ? Guess what ?

Speaker 2 15:55

That's what I told even Haitian people . They're saying , like you know , all the white men , the desk , hey , they're so bad . I said you know what man ? let's just build our place , let's build our city , let's build our neighborhood . I remember , in the neighborhood we are right now , in Brooklyn and in Hawton , Three years ago , when we opened the restaurant , it was 11 , three deaths . But we started doing community work . We started black industry , doing black bodies . We started , like you know , having , like you know , city council people coming in the area And , like you know , we have great food People coming from Manhattan . We're getting visibility from CBS , abc , like New York Times , and they're sharing that on word zero .

Speaker 1 16:33

That's amazing . That is amazing . I am . I mean , i'm so excited , audience . I do not know if you hear the excitement , because this is the work that we all talk about wanting to see , and Wesley's doing that . So let's shift a little bit to talk about how you went from having your first restaurant to now having what three business , or the third business open . What was that process like And what are the lessons you have learned And would you encourage anyone else to do as it comes to opening a business in the community ?

Speaker 2 17:11

You can open any business in the community . You can open any restaurant if you want to . My advice do not open anything . You have no background . Do not open anything . You're not an expert . Stay in your lane . Stay in your lane . Don't think you got a background in finance and you don't have $2 million . You're going to open a restaurant . You will fail . You will hate your life , you will hate the business . You will be like why did I get my stuff into it ? My only thing I did not have the money , but I have the experience . I had the expertise , so I'm worth four , five men in my business compared to somebody who has money but don't have the expertise , so you're gonna have to pay four , five men to do that type of job . So my best advice to anybody you can do whatever you want in life It's your prerogative and actually do it with blindness . But do not go outside of your lane . Don't paint outside of the line . Do something you do , you know how and you will be successful at it . Have some type of background in it , because if you try to get your way in the restaurant business , you will close . We usually call it green opening , green closing , because , believe me , it's hard . From what they're saying I've already .

Speaker 2 18:26

Yeah , i think it's the hardest business to open in the world . The restaurant business is the hardest business . I mean it's the best business , the finest business . It's feeding people , it's the love , the energy . But keep it going . The back end of it is the hardest spot , especially in the city like New York .

Speaker 2 18:44

There's a lot of rules and regulations . There's a lot of violation you can run into Even setting up a restaurant from scratch . Like if you don't have a hand wash taking a certain area , it's a violation . They'll shut you down . If you don't have , like , a grease trap and they're setting in a certain way on a certain fee , it's a violation . If you store your stuff , it's got to be six inches off the ground . Anything on the floor is a violation , because New York State is after the money . So for you to operate you got to be operating within the guidelines And that's one thing I always tell restaurant owners when , like you know , they want me to come and consult for them .

Speaker 2 19:20

If they're a black restaurant , a Caribbean restaurant , i'll do it for free , because I know you don't have the money . I'm not after your money . I'm in America , i know where the money's at , so I will come for free , i'll walk , then I'll do a walkthrough by myself . I don't want the only next minute . I don't want nobody , like you know , being biased of what I need to do as my knowledge and understand my experiences . Then when I hit them with three or four pages worth of violation , they're like yeah , that's what it takes to run a restaurant in Brooklyn . And I'm kind of seeing , like on my block alone , six restaurants closed beside hardship health department too , and we don't have the expertise . We try our best .

Speaker 2 20:00

Somebody said you go a great chef or you're a great cook . You're a great cook . Then next thing you know you got some tax money or somebody fall into your head . You open a restaurant , then next thing you know the steak come at me . It's a dream crusher . So it's really hard . Don't do nothing outside of your life . You got to have some kind of knowledge , like you . Being a podcast , i bet you listen to it a million times before you get into it . So you make it your life . So that's what I want people to do , you're right .

Speaker 1 20:28

It took me a couple of years before I decided to launch a podcast . From the time I wanted to do it to the time I launched , it was two , almost three years . There you go .

Speaker 2 20:38

So you have to at least get a . let's just get an associate degree in it Pretty much . You know there's a joke , like in the restaurant business , like every time somebody makes a mistake or has a big tap , a loss . Like you know , in the restaurant business somebody lost some tap of money And we'll look at each other like , hmm , so you just got another degree in stupid . You have to pay for it .

Speaker 1 20:58

No , but you know what ? You just brought up an amazing point , because there are so many restaurant closings and you said it's one thing about the financing and the availability , but , just like the regulations make it really hard for small businesses or small restaurants to even survive . So I think you made up . You know that was just a good point , because I know a lot of us . We look out and say , wow , this restaurant is no longer here And you wonder what happened . But you're giving us some insight and why it's important for the community to support the restaurants in our community , especially the ones that you know are representing the culture . So now , what are you looking to do in the future with all these restaurants and business ? I have to come and try it out , because you are so excited about the food . I'm excited about it

Drive With Blindness

Speaker 1 21:55

already .

Speaker 2 21:55

Our biggest issue right now , really in the part , is we grow in so fast and I'm a very aggressive businessman , like in certain part . Like you know , if I find an opportunity I'm not going to let it go . The next thing I'm going to go . I ain't got no luck . I'm not that type of guy . If it is an opportunity , i'm going to jump on it . If it is something , i'm going to try my best . If I fail , i fail , try it on my feet , not on my back . So I'm that type of person and I think sky's the limit , because if I could look at the sky , i can reach out my hands and grab it . So I'm that type of guy . It's beautiful , it's a great thing We're doing right now in the community .

Speaker 2 22:31

We're getting a lot of praise . The back end is very hard with finance and everything else . Like you know , payroll , like all the violations , what we got to do with the bills is winding up And New York City is extremely expensive . The rent is out of the freaking world . Now we have three . We want to find two in every day . So we were just busy like no , we got this one , we're opening this one , we're opening this one . So we wasn't paying attention to really focus , like me as a chef . Now I wanna stop , take a break and start doing culinary stuff . Like you said earlier in the beginning , i wanna start putting pictures on plates . I wanna do structure on chef tables , special events , like people can actually see Caribbean food can be played , can be represented in certain lights , cause I'm being invited to a lot of different like shows and competitions and everything else , so I can be playing Caribbean food like it was the best I'd invited . So I gotta start taking my time now to show , showcase .

Speaker 2 23:30

My next focus is about showcasing Caribbean food . Like you know , hit those TV shows like Bobby Flay , chef Tables , health Kitchen , whatever it is like I need to hit . Like you know , next week I'm doing the dish with CBS . So I gotta represent , like you know , haitian culture , the Caribbean culture , little Haiti , little Caribbean , how we have this great gem in this neighborhood and how can we invite the rest of the world to come see it . So that's what my next focus is gonna be on . So when people gonna see us on TV , see us on the news or on a podcast , we not try to like no blow up , make money . There's really not that much money in two or three restaurants when you have two or three partners . My focus is what I wanted to do first , from the beginning , so I'm taking back the basic . I wanna be a chef again , not a businessman . I wanna be a chef again . I wanna feed people . I wanna show the culture to the rest of the world .

Speaker 2 24:28

Like you know , we on Instagram people's fighting us from Tyrone . I'm like what the hell is Tyrone ? I'm seeing people following us from Istanbul . I'm like , okay , istanbul , are you in the house ? And they haven't come in under us . So that's Istanbul that never had Haitian food , that never had Caribbean food . And they're wondering now that , digging into our pages , like when I'm in New York , i know what to check out . It's not about Haitian or anything . It's about black food stepping up , just like African food is doing their thing right now . Nigeria we invented food .

Speaker 1 25:01

So that brings me to the other question that I have , the culinary arts . so most of us are home taught , home grown , and not many are encouraged to formally go to school and perfect this art . So what do you say to anyone listening , a parent , a godparent , whoever , to encourage folks to take their career to that next level ? you know , consider culinary school , whatever it is .

Speaker 2 25:31

I don't have a culinary degree . What ? Yes , i've been trained by newer chefs , so when you're looking at it , i was an apprentice . Ooh , i put my head down .

Speaker 1 25:44

So that's the next question How do more people get into apprenticeships then ?

Speaker 2 25:48

I can tell you how to get to apprenticeship . But right now , to finish my story , i work with Chef . I work with racist Chef that throw a plate at me . But I had to learn . Yes , chef , just like you see on TV , when you're working with a chef , he don't need your opinion , you want his knowledge . Shop the hell up and learn . It's simple . There's no place for cockiness in the kitchen . There's no place for arrogance in the kitchen . Unless you're running your own kitchen , the chef don't need your opinion .

Speaker 2 26:19

The chef did not put everything on the line , open his restaurant , everything he owns , to hear your mouth , especially if his restaurant is successful . If you want to learn this art , you got to work for it . I got people that went to culinary school . They're working in my kitchen when I was working in the city . I find them in the two days . It's not for them . Going to school for culinary doesn't make you a chef . No one ought to go to school plate something . Do it at home . When you take six hours to make two plates doesn't make you a chef . Chef is agility , speed and the know-how . If you don't have the agility , you don't have the speed . You have the eye for it . You cannot be a chef . First thing in being a chef is speed and agility , simple . That's why chefs have very high tempered . They're drive with blinders . It's just like something clear . They're on automatic , they're rolling .

Speaker 1 27:10

You just used a term that you used previously and I meant to ask you to clarify it , and now you're bringing it up again . You said drive with blindness . Tell me what that means .

Speaker 2 27:20

For me what it means with me When I wanted to open the restaurant , everybody knows I could cook Yeah , great cook . I got a chef job . I got a manager . Get your manager's job . But can you do it ? First of all , you came from Haiti third of our country , from the slums . You don't have the money . How can you raise the fund to get it done ? Who are you going to listen to saying you can't do this ? you can't do that Because we grew up in a culture that nobody believed in each other , because that's what they put in their head , just like you're talking about .

Speaker 2 27:52

The jerk chicken , the plate and the Caribbean food cannot be played . We always seen the negative part of everything . So that's when you put your blinders on . I'm going to play it . I'm going to get it done . I don't care what you said , i don't care what my mom said , i don't care what my sister said , my friends , my ex-girlfriend , anybody . I'll lose relationship to get this started . If that's what you want for your dream , get it done . Stop talking to people , stop entertaining people crap , stop , stop . The focus should be on you Blinders Like you're like a horse running down an aisle Until you get to that goal . Don't stop running . Do not stop running , and I think that's how every Caribbean is supposed to be when they're doing something Get to the finish line . There's a saying in Creole that the world don't care how you make it . The world don't want to know how you make it , they only believe in results . At the end , give them results .

Speaker 1 28:54

Wow , wow , wow , wow . They only want the results , not the how . Ok .

Speaker 2 29:03

They don't want the story Yeah .

Speaker 1 29:05

They don't want the story And the victim always tell the story .

Speaker 2 29:07

at the end of the day , right Doesn't matter . There's 300 people behind this And he's an asshole . I'm telling a story .

Speaker 1 29:13

Wow , wow . This is just such an amazing , energetic conversation for me , because I feel the passion coming through And , like I said , i feel your drive and this desire to tell everybody that we can do better and we're doing better . And look look at what I'm doing . You are just saying that I don't care , i don't care .

Speaker 2 29:36

Whatever you're saying , i don't listen . You could be on TV , on radio , saying how Haiti got gangs , this , that I don't care , but I got a gang of food in my kitchen right now And I got a gang of people coming outside to taste my food . So if you want to look at those gangs , but there's other people that want to see the gang that I'm creating right now , the culinary gang , the positivness , the people that's willing to drop , the people that's willing to sit down at the table and showcase our culture . We are not what they portrayed us to be . We are not the slums . We invented peanut butter . Stop playing , and we've got to show you guys . We've got to do peanut butter all over again .

Speaker 2 30:19

So I don't have the time to listen to the negative . Like you know , with people around me , like friends and family . Oh look , if you want to listen , you don't run a business . Don't tell me I don't run a business . You don't even own a business . What do you own out of the farm ? I don't tell you how to catch a train in the morning . Stop , i'm driving with blindness . If I f**k up , f**k it up .

Speaker 2 30:40

But everybody knows I wake up every morning and do it . I do 16 to 12 hours daily , doesn't matter if I'm at home with the business or I'm at home with the responding to email , doing this interview or anything . I'm driving my business every hour . I get a chance to . That's what we lack of in our community . We got two goddamn comfortable in America . We need to start getting so comfortable . This is not our country . We're going to take the money in this country and take it back to our island and celebrate . I always tell people I come to America with a suitcase full of clothes . I'm leaving America with a suitcase full of money . Nobody's going to stop .

Speaker 1 31:19

I mean , that's a great way to even end this conversation . So what would you tell anyone listening if they come to the restaurant and they want to try something And I know this is hard because all the dishes are your babies But if they would come to Zami , right , if they come there , if I come there , what's the one dish you would recommend that ? I definitely carry on . You have to try it .

Speaker 2 31:43

You know , past three weeks , because I've been asked this question so many times . I learn how to answer it now , because most chefs never learn how to answer this question . So , as a black person , have you ever had Haitian food before ?

Speaker 1 31:53

I have , yes , i've been to Haiti .

Speaker 2 31:55

So , basically , if you've been to Haiti , you had Haitian food before . Let's stay away from the typical north .

Speaker 1 32:00

Yes , the picuris and the Yeah .

Speaker 2 32:03

The gruyo , the cabbages ? Let's stay away from it . Now I got some good octopus on the menu with some good potato bedding with oil crying there with a quill sauce . How about you try that ? I got a nice duck to die for . I tell anybody I can put my duck against any duck in Brooklyn . Maybe in New York you could try the duck .

Speaker 2 32:21

You know we got ducks in the island . We love duck , but mine is like greasy , fatty . You got to strip the fat off . We drain the fat from the duck , then we make the duck , because you know we're from the island . Unless we're eating fat , we're eating fat . If we're not eating fat , we want to taste it . So if not , you could do the soft-shelled crab . You could do something else . Oh , i got a quill muscle with a spicy pepper sauce on it . You could do the muscles . But you know , in that we're from the islands , we eat all types of seafood . To begin with , anyway , i love my shrimp . There you go . You could do the quill shrimp's camping . Ooh , you see what I'm saying .

Speaker 2 33:00

There's something on the menu for almost everyone . I did not create this menu and act like oh , we're going to do the same 10 items that's in every to-go spots in Brooklyn . We got sandwiches , we got vegan options , we got everything . So we want the world to walk in and try our food . So if I'm trying to cater to the world , i need to cater to everybody . I cannot be stuck , like you know . Okay , we're going to do traditional way and just stuck with it , and that's it .

Speaker 2 33:27

And that's why most Haitian restaurants fail You in America . You're not in it . You cannot stick to the traditional way . You got to give the rest of the world that never had your food . So we got a sandwich called the Milo sandwich . It's marinated in jerk . That's a chicken breast tie marinated in jerk . Then we grill it , we put it on sandwiches some pickled peppers and onions , lettuce , tomato and some nice creole creamy sauce , aioli . So people are going to eat that with some seasoned fries . So we never had Haitian food and try to play it safe . So we got to slowly introducing them . So next time they had the restaurant , like yo , we had the sandwich . Man , i'm going to try to grill . So that's the newbies . But for somebody like you , be the Haiti , let's go outside of the box right now . Let's start calling somewhere else .

Speaker 1 34:12

I love it . I love it . I'm so excited . All right , so why don't you tell everyone where they could find you and follow you on the internet ? and then I'll also make sure I put the links to the restaurants . And I want to try everything . It's like summer's coming Foodie time . We're going on a food crawl . I really feel so excited about the food . I want to try everything . So tell me where they could find you .

Marketing and Food Talk

Speaker 2 34:35

Best thing about like , in other words , zami . Zami means friends in Creole And in French , so Zami means friends . So if you type you Google Z A N , m , i , zami , first thing that will come up is my restaurant . We managed to get to the top of the word Zami . So when people are talking about Zami , they're not talking about friends , no more , they're talking about my restaurant now . So it's so easy to find that stuff .

Speaker 1 35:00

Look at the synergy . It means friends , you're on . Carry on friends , we friends Yes .

Speaker 2 35:05

Yes , definitely . So when you type Zami NYC , that come , that's straight to our website . And if you go to our website it's going to link you up to the other restaurants . So the word friends , you just have Zami in Creole . Oh , you can type friends in Creole to Google . That will show you Zami . So we managed to get to the top of the algorithm to be more like searchable . So it's that easy .

Speaker 1 35:28

That is also a good lesson about marketing , seo , all of that amazing stuff that happens when you're running a business and how hard it is and how long it takes just to get that top ranking . So congrats to you and the team for making that And I am just really proud and excited . Love this conversation . I don't get to talk about food a lot . I love food And so you coming on this podcast to just , you know , talk about or cuisine in a way that's exciting And , like you said , like you know , normally we get excited about food . When I go to Jamaica , i don't go to Jamaica to the beach , i go to Jamaica just for the food .

Speaker 2 36:08

I'll tell you , i went to Jamaica for the first time last year , a month ago today . That's where I'm from , really . You from Mobile .

Speaker 1 36:15

Yes , i'm from Mobile And I um . So unfortunately , last year I went because my my father , passed away and my family , thank you my grand uncles . They were known fishermen And so every Saturday morning , when I used to go and visit my dad , a lot of people came and they would want that fresh fish out of the water , the marlin , everything . I was just so used to that lifestyle and just you know so my cousins made me lobster and they did um scallops and all of these things And I was just like fruits from the sea .

Speaker 1 36:49

Yes , yes , yes , oh my God , yes , so you went to Mobile and I mean , i love food . That's all I do when I go home . I want to go to this place , that place , it's so I'm , i'm so excited . I I love this conversation . Wesley , thank you so much for being on the podcast and bringing me some food joy .

Speaker 2 37:07

Yes , yes , yes .

Speaker 1 37:09

And , as I love to say at the end of every episode walk good .