Speaker 1: 0:03

Everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Carry On Friends podcast. We are the Dualla Cooking. That's different. For this episode. We are starting a new series called Circle Back. So Circle Back is a new series where we are going to catch up with past guests. As you know, carry On Friends they're about for the last nine years and so we've had many guests and with that we want to catch up and check in with some of the guests. And so the guests we're about to circle back to and check in what's going on with her is Camilla Campbell, who let me tell you which episode she was on In 2015. She was on the podcast November 2015. That's some teen numbers that are like episode 15 or something like that, some hurly numbers.

Speaker 1: 0:55

And what was so interesting? I went back to my notes that I had on the podcast and I was like whoa, I have gems and all of these things. So I'm excited to have Camilla back on the podcast. Camilla is sister in for real. For real, camilla.

Speaker 1: 1:10

What's going on? What's going on? Carry? Good to be back, circle back. You know what I'm saying Keep the people updated as to what is happening, what is going on in the world, but anyway. So, camilla, I'm so glad you're here and I was looking back at some of the notes that I had and it's so interesting that talked about money Mondays your first Monday where you did finances and look how recently we talked about it first Fridays, fries, and finance Fridays, because Fridays in my household is fries day and then adding that monthly commitment of doing bookkeeping and doing all that stuff for business.

Speaker 1: 1:56

And I just went back and I was like everything just full circle. We're a circle. Back to the notes and it's kind of showing that we are, we're keep to a word, we're take with one advice, and so I have a lot of questions for you. I'm going to run through them really quickly, but before that, tell the community a little bit about who you are and the work that you do, just in case they didn't listen to the episode back in November 2015. Well, 2015.

Speaker 2: 2:28

My name is Camilla. I am a jewelry designer. I specialize in metal Smith jewelry. I've been in business this year, made 15 years, so I'm kind of an OG when it comes to this industry, this class. I have my own standing website. I'm still on Amazon handmade. I now have a brand registry because I've been trademarked. So now I have a little bit more avenues to travel along that path. My items are in about 20 to 25 stores, let's see. And since then I think my work has been featured in a lot of different media outlets and it's been featured in quite a few shows, so a lot of scenes are sewn back then that came to fruition after that, so lots to catch up on for sure.

Speaker 1: 3:22

I mean, where do I even begin? Where do I even begin? All right. So I had my questions written down, because I went back and listened to the episode intentionally, just to get some of the questions. So in that episode you talked about a subscription box. Are you still doing subscription boxes?

Speaker 2: 3:43

And it's funny you actually said no. And I believe when I did the subscription boxes a lot of time you had interviewed me. It was something thoroughly new that I was doing. But that's one of those business ventures that you look at and you're kind of like, well, it's not really working, so you kind of need to pivot, and pivot fast. Although it was a good idea, it just was not profitable and it just was not worth the work that was put into it. It was hard to actually detach from it because I thought it was like a really really good idea and the customers were sad to see it go, but the profit margins on it just didn't make sense. So that was one of my pivot fast and cut losses as soon as you can. Type on experiences.

Speaker 1: 4:27

So how do you know when to cut losses? What do you use to help guide you into when something is not profitable and to just like, cut your losses and move?

Speaker 2: 4:37

on. I think everybody has a different benchmark. Because I'm selling jewelry, If it's not selling within six months to 12 months, it's really not worth hanging on to. And that selling well, in this case it was selling, but in order for me to actually make a profit off of it, it would cause me to have to raise the price of the boxes to something that I just didn't think was sustainable when you're thinking about how much a customer averages when spending with you. So I weighed the pros and cons of it, but I think it really just takes back to looking at what your numbers are and deciding how much longer are you willing to take a loss on this to potentially gain a profit? I learned real quick, and that was definitely one of the lessons that I learned from that.

Speaker 1: 5:32

The other thing you talked about on the podcast was having a buyer persona. We've heard this talked about a lot of times. It's not necessarily limited to jewelry. If you have a blog or if you have any type of audience, it's good to have a persona. Are you still using a persona? How have they evolved over the past? What years now, and what is your advice today?

Speaker 2: 5:58

Yeah, so I definitely still use the buyer persona. Obviously, my customer has evolved, particularly if you were a customer with me 15 years ago and you're still a customer with me today. Your income has changed, so I've noticed that those customers are spending a lot more now, you know, because they have a higher income. We all love that idea right Ring in the money, but I also have an influx in of new customers as well. So I'm finding that I'm probably catering to maybe three different customer types, and the one thing that I do look at is I dig deep into what the interests of the customers are. What are they actually spending money on? When it comes to the pink locket, because a lot of times, customers will say they like this. You should do this Because I do take a lot of feedback from customers, right, and then when you go ahead and launch it, the ones that are requesting are the ones buying it. So I'm looking at what their purchase activity actually is and I take that into consideration when I'm actually creating new product.

Speaker 1: 7:10

I'm glad you say that because I get a lot of feedback. So with carry on friends, I have unapologetically Jamaican because I'm Jamaican. And then everyone says you should have one for Trinidad, you should have one for Barbados, you should have for all of these things, and I'm like no, because you say that. But if I should print up all of these things y'all won't buy it. So for now I know I can wear unapologetically Jamaican because I'm Jamaican and I can get, worst case scenario, the whole of my family for buying the inventory because they're Jamaican. Of course, backup plan Exactly, you need a backup plan. So how do you balance? Maybe you've answered it, but for my purposes, when I ask for your friend when I ask for me how do you balance?

Speaker 1: 7:59

Because those suggestions aren't bad ideas. Most customers aren't coming with bad ideas, it's just that. Will this idea translate in profits and sales? How do you balance?

Speaker 2: 8:11

that it's just a matter of testing. Honestly, you don't know. There's no amount of analysis, it's going with the gut and putting something out there and seeing it themselves Under the sun. You can analyze all you want, pick up residency in your head, deciding whether or not, and you do that by just doing a small sample set, see what the feedback is on that. A bunch of businesses just launching and testing to see what works, because what works for one business might not work for the other. And there's artistry in that Because I can take the input. Okay, how do I put my spin on it and put it out there to see how it does? So that's pretty much what it is.

Speaker 1: 8:59

Yeah, there's nothing for sure and testing is a good way, but there's too many countries in the Caribbean from the Tesla. I'm apologetically part of it.

Speaker 2: 9:08

If that not going to work, yeah, I don't know, and you have to do it within your limits too, because you can definitely go testing all these different ideas. So you have to do it within the limits.

Speaker 1: 9:21

Yes, yes. This is why I love this conversation, because you know the things Like if you get sample for everything. That's ridiculous, it's expensive. And then when you have samples, sit down where you're going to with them. So funny. All right, you've been doing jewelry for a very long time. How has your skill improved or evolved over the years, and how has that impacted the style of your jewelry?

Speaker 2: 9:52

Okay, I think I wonder was it was. Maybe about four years ago I actually took a traditional metal smithing class because up until this time I was self taught. But I thought it was time for me to actually, if I wanted to evolve not only my craft but also the production, speeding up on how fast I get pieces out it was necessary for me to actually learn from someone. So I actually did take a traditional jewelry smithing class and I learned a whole lot. I learned a whole lot of ways I could just do things a lot faster.

Speaker 2: 10:25

I learned facets of jewelry making that I hated, like sawing metal. I absolutely hated that. My teacher was very patient and I learned to love it and figure out how I could actually use it in future products. So I think that's been. One of the major changes that I've done over the years is that I just keep evolving my craft and I even taught my sons and at one point my husband was soldering at one point for me too, so it enabled me to actually took what I learned, turn it over to others who could possibly, if I needed it, jump in and kind of help.

Speaker 1: 11:06

I think that story highlights something very important that you know balancing where you are at a point in your career or experience and at what level you decide to see a need to level up and get some like courses from professionals and maybe not only people who sell things online. There's nothing wrong with that. But you really have to do your research about what is going to really help you level up and develop the skills that you need. So I like that. You did that. So how is the style? So you tell me that, yeah, man, you go class, you're self taught. Auntie Marlene did teach you.

Speaker 1: 11:47

I know you said boom, I'm going to do this I've gotten better and so now you can't sort of fast you learn the tips and tricks and stuff like that. So how is the style of your pieces evolved so we can see this in fashion? How certain you know like when I just came to America everybody was into Tommy Hill figure. You see how Tommy Hill figure evolve over the years. How has the pink locket designs evolved over the years?

Speaker 2: 12:16

I think I went from more simplistic designs to a little bit more intricate. Actually it was in that class. That project was the Jamaica Cuff bracelet, and out of that was the chain. I did create a Barbados Island necklace as well. So out of that, I had never sold anything like that before. Right, I brought in the product I want to do this island. She's like, she's Canadian, she's like. She's like that's Jamaica, she's like oh, that's a challenge but I think you can do it, you know. So you know, that's one product that actually came out of my training. And then there were other things as well. Some of the hoops that I design now are a lot different than what I used to offer. I'm offering a lot more rings now just because of that skill set. So I would say it helped me to actually be more comfortable in offering a variety of more products than I probably did before.

Speaker 1: 13:18

So everyone, man, how do I say this? Camilla made this Jamaica bracelet, this cuff, and I love it. And what's so sentimental is that she took the outline of the cuff and made a necklace for my very good sister, michaela. So she has the cut out and I have the cuff. So it's so sweet, but it's. I love that bracelet Whenever.

Speaker 1: 13:45

I wear it everyone's like oh, I like it. So I'm gonna say, yeah, this is where I'm gonna get it from. Don't watch my things. But you know, I can see that because I just love that bracelet. And immediately when I saw it, I was like, yeah, I had to get that one. So see there, you go school, you learn things, you learn and level up. So that's amazing. Which success are you most proud of?

Speaker 2: 14:10

I would have to say longevity. I mean, I've been here 15 years. I've seen a lot of not not just jewelry makers, but just a lot of entrepreneurs that were in the trenches with me when I started and a lot of them didn't really, you know, they kind of either gave up, you know, or you know they moved on to other things. You know they were passionate about other things, or it just wasn't for them to actually stick out something this long and honestly, it wasn't. I wasn't very profitable in the first five years, you know, because I was testing a lot of things. You know, you're just learning. A lot of times people after the third year, people are ready to give up, you know, because how much money can you pour into something that's not producing anything, you know. And then, not to mention, jewelry was a very saturated and still is a very saturated market, but you know, just finding your niche. But I would say longevity, I'm still here.

Speaker 1: 15:07

No man, that's a good thing. I think it's the same thing. People asked me about podcasting. Like you know, you've been around and I said, boy, you know, slowly but surely, maybe turkle, I'll go on on the thing, and I think one part of that is pacing yourself. I think it's easy to get caught up in the excitement of what we see other people do on social media and to have people like you check yourself and say, oh, my girl come up. No, no, you're hurting that Sickle.

Speaker 2: 15:36

Sickle.

Speaker 1: 15:39

You know. But that's important because you know I'm sure there's a science out there or there's a research out there that almost as if when you go on social media it's like something else goes autopilot and your brain starts doing something else that you're not even aware, that you're swept up into this thing, and so just having people to say, hey, you know, that's good, that works for them, but you're not there or is not your thing. You need to pace yourself and take time, and that contributes to longevity. So congratulations, 15 year veteran in the business. So, given your 15 year tenure, what's one thing you wish you knew when you first started? And then, based on that, what advice would you give to someone starting their own business now?

Speaker 2: 16:30

I would say when I first started, if I knew the importance of actually building your business credit earlier on in my business phase, I would have done it. And the reason I say that is because a lot of times, as entrepreneurs, we pour a lot of our own personal finances into our business. Not that you shouldn't you, of course you shouldn't your passion, but when I began to learn of the ways that different businesses operate off of using other people's money, you know it's a definition of getting you to a certain spot that you've probably been struggling to get to. So I would say, if I knew what I knew over the past few years, I definitely would have spent more time on building my actual business.

Speaker 2: 17:22

You know you saw the LLC. Just, you know you think you're. You know you have a big Kingsville or whatever, but you know you're not really. What is the point of money in the LLC? We need to build business credit here, right? You know that takes off the liability of you personally, which you want to do, you know. So I think that's that's one thing I would have done earlier, much earlier.

Speaker 1: 17:43

I think I saw it on social media years ago where Arsha kind of said there's a switch right. So with your personal finance you're, like you know, want to call no credit. You know no credit card debt, but that's a different mindset when it comes to business. Completely completely, and we have to learn the hard way about that because you're free.

Speaker 2: 18:04

Yeah, yeah, it's. It is completely different. I mean, with business credit, you are encouraged to apply for as much as possible and you know it's not. It's very different from personal credit, you know it is very different.

Speaker 1: 18:18

It's because we're free and we don't have enough information and everybody's flossing about I made millions of dollars and that's no one's we're not talking about, like the episode I had with Keisha the teacher. Like we're not talking about finance or money openly because there's shame, there's fear of judgment and, let's be honest, most of us don't know nothing. We don't try to figure it out and it's okay to say we're figuring it out.

Speaker 2: 18:48

And it's okay, and that's the thing it's okay to say. You're figuring it out. I knew nothing about. We all know personal credit. I need a new personal credit, right, and I knew everything about personal credit. To be quite frank and honest, you know it took me actually once again investing that's another class that I took over the last few years how to build my business for this. I'm a reputable person, you know. So you know what you know and you don't know what you don't know.

Speaker 1: 19:15

For sure and being okay with what you know and what you don't know. That's going to be key. So what has been your biggest challenge? Oh, biggest challenge.

Speaker 2: 19:28

So I'm going to say all right, so we're in 2023. So in 2020, that's whole pandemic phase, right? We all know what happened. Everybody rushed to go buy, support black businesses. You know, the month of June 2020 was my highest grossing month that I've ever had, and when I mean it was my highest grossing month, it was well over. It was like in the mid five digits. Just for that one month.

Speaker 2: 20:03

I'm a one person show. Of course I have help, but you know it's very limited. Most people say what is a good problem to have, but it's not necessarily a good problem to have if you don't have certain processes in place to support the sales that is coming in. Okay, I packed, and how am I gonna get all of this done? Then to find out I had COVID midway through June. Well, no production can get done cuz we're doing a quarantine account and not halt production, as halted production stop. Okay.

Speaker 2: 20:42

I learned, let me tell you something, the month of June. I learned a lot of things and I learned it really quick because if I didn't, I would have ended up having to refund a whole lot more customers, right, and, for the most part, a lot of customers. They were understanding, luckily, you know, because I acted quick on my toes right, and since then I was just like alright, it's really time to really start putting processes in place, as though I have not the only one doing everything. You know. You know still working on hiring more part-time people to help me, who were, who had the skillset, but I know that it helped me eliminate what things were not working in my business and what things I needed to amp up so that things would run smoothly in cases like that is each piece made to order?

Speaker 1: 21:30

are you mix some peace and put on it's a mix?

Speaker 2: 21:33

of both. There are some pieces that are I have inventory for, and then there are other pieces that are made to order and that was one of the things to where I say we're business credit comes in handy because it costs a lot of money to actually have inventory. And we're not talking about cheap inventory. We're talking about gold, we're talking about silver, and the price of gold right now is maybe a little less than $2,000 an ounce silver, I think it's a. It's much cheaper but it's still expensive. So you can't really go out and just purchase a whole bunch of supplies and make product and have it sit down, because you need to push these products. So it's a balance of two. But what I also learned is that you know what it's time to eliminate, certain products that are not working to. So it makes you do a deep dive into your business.

Speaker 1: 22:21

Yeah, for sure. Trust me, carrying inventory is is not, is not an easy road no, no, not at all.

Speaker 2: 22:30

And you just looking at it like why isn't it moving? What can I do to move this inventory?

Speaker 1: 22:34

you know shot I selling it for $5 well, that's what.

Speaker 2: 22:40

Well, that's when I started doing mystery boxes, because that's what was brought out. Like I'm sitting on this inventory. Well, let's, let's package it up and create some mystery boxes and just, you know, get it out of here. You know, make sense all right.

Speaker 1: 22:53

So what are two big or maybe three big big lessons you learned and wish more people talked about? So alright, maybe two, because you told us business credit. So what are two other big lessons that you learned and you're like why aren't more people talking about this?

Speaker 2: 23:09

I think one of the things is the importance of hiring, of putting a hiring process in place even if you're not ready, like if you needed somebody to step in and do something for you. In the case that I had, what could they do? What is something that's easily offloadable off of your plate, right? And you have to also understand that they're not gonna do it as well as you do in the beginning, and that's okay. I think a lot of us have a lot of attachment to that. You know, it's okay, they're gonna mess up.

Speaker 2: 23:38

You know, my thing is like, as long as you, I see the driver that you're willing to, you know, do the work and kind of learn. I can work with that. Can't work with lazy, but I can work with that right. So that's one thing. Like, even if you're not, you feel that you're not at that level yet.

Speaker 2: 23:56

Start doing your processes, putting documentation, whatever you need to do, in place early, so that you know, because most of us when we get ready to hire, we don't have that stuff in place, so we're scrambling to do it right. And then building I did say building the business card, I think is just I'm gonna reiterate that one too definitely I would. I would definitely advise anybody to do that and then test product you're not sure about. If you're a product-based business, don't be afraid to go to your core customers and have them do tests, survey your customers. You know, a lot of times we're so personally attached to our products particularly if we make them or if there are baby we hate to hear about feedback on it, but it's the feedback we need to hear and that's okay wonderful, all right, so now to some fun questions before we wrap up.

Speaker 1: 24:52

Okay, what are you reading, watching or listening to?

Speaker 2: 24:59

Geez, what am I reading? I don't even know the boot name. Oh here, it's actually right here, so hold on. It's called when no One Is Watching and it actually talks about gentrification. It's a fiction novel, but it talks about the gentrification of Brooklyn, so it's actually pretty interesting. That's what I'm reading right now. I'm trying to read fun stuff. I'm trying to read not fun stuff, but things that don't have my mind, where I have to have a book and a notepad writing down stuff, just something to kind of just release the mind a bit, something with a plot.

Speaker 1: 25:36

No, I feel you because I feel like for the last two, three years I haven't read anything leisurely. Everything has been like book to study something to learn, something but that book sounds interesting Okay all right, go on.

Speaker 2: 25:49

What are you?

Speaker 1: 25:50

listening to.

Speaker 2: 25:51

What am I watching? I just finished watching Bridgerton. I'm watching fun stuff now. So Bridgerton, I just finished watching Queen Charlotte, which I think was probably one of the best of all the Bridgerton stories. And what am I listening to? You know, a lot of times because I'm listening to a lot of like jazz, because it kind of just like I'm working a lot and I need something to kind of just like release the tension, you know. So I find myself that I'm playing a lot more jazz music in the background whenever I'm doing anything.

Speaker 1: 26:26

Mm, I was thinking of Tessalated. You gon' learn some jazz today. That's what I heard in my head, but anyway, I know that's not the jazz you're talking about, but anyway, Anyway, we're gonna practice my voice. Anyway, what is the most over? In your opinion, the most overrated thing is fill in the blank.

Speaker 2: 26:48

Instagram right about now, puh-puh-puh-puh. Maybe not Instagram, but the influx of experts on Instagram. Let me be very clear.

Speaker 1: 27:06

We feel that pain, we feel that pain and then fill in the blank. The most underrated thing is Self-love, that's a good one, that's a good one. Self-love why self-love?

Speaker 2: 27:22

I just feel we beat up on ourselves a lot more than we think we are. So, particularly, if you come, Because of Instagram, because of.

Speaker 2: 27:30

Instagram. Because of Instagram, there you go connection. You know we are so busy looking at what we're not doing, what's Maria Elsa do? And I tell people it's more than likely it's a lie. So stop comparing yourself. And we are just so hard on ourselves and it shows. It shows in what we say, what we do, sometimes even our parents, and sometimes even how we respond to our children. It's true, our spouses, people around us, and we're like, oh, I'm going to listen to this podcast and I'm like, oh see, witness Witness.

Speaker 1: 28:15

Witness Says, the women who just raised up them husbands, exit the room Can't say I'm about to record Baby. I got to thank you, oh God, yeah, no, that's a good point. That's a good point. Well, camilla, I'm so glad to have you back as my inaugural guest of the Circleback series. I couldn't have picked a better person to kick this off. So any last words before we wrap up, close the loop on this Circleback.

Speaker 2: 28:53

Last words now. Just be nice to yourself in, carry fashion, walk good, and I'll just learn to not take certain things serious. Well, sometimes it's not that serious.

Speaker 1: 29:06

All right. Well, there you have it. Why don't you tell people I mean, we just want IG but tell the people that we're not going to have to find it anyway, you can't find it from IG.

Speaker 2: 29:16

I'm going to ask that person. Ig at the pink locket, my website pinklocketcom. Facebook. Pink locket. You want to email me, camilla, at the pink locketcom All right everybody.

Speaker 1: 29:30

Thank you so much for listening and until next time, while we go, do walk good.