A Morning That Changes Everything

SPEAKER_01 0:00

October 20th, 2011, I woke up in the morning and um got myself dressed and I went to get him up out of his crib. And I touched him, and I knew from the time I touched him, I knew something was wrong.

SPEAKER_00 0:33

Hello everyone, welcome back to another episode of Carry On Friends, the Caribbean American Experience. And my guest today is Cheyenne. Cheyenne, welcome to the podcast. How are you feeling? Thank you. Thank you. I am just happy to be here. So why don't you tell the community of friends a little bit about who you are, Caribbean country you represent, and talk to us about the work that you

Meeting Cheyenne And Her Mission

SPEAKER_00 1:00

do. Sure.

SPEAKER_01 1:01

My name is Cheyenne Chester. I am Guyanese-born, Brooklyn grown. My formative years I spent in Guyana, came to America at 15. I am a community builder. Right now, my main focus is my nonprofit organization, which was created in honor of my son Dallas, the Dallas Lamar Project. And, you know, I've worked in healthcare for about 16 or so years, up until the beginning of this year, when I was like, listen, I think it's time for me to take a plunge. And here I am, a builder of things, building my nonprofit.

SPEAKER_00 1:48

All right. So before we get to the nonprofit, why this year did you decide to step away from your professional career and to focus on the nonprofit? Because then that's the story leading up, and then we'll talk about the nonprofit.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

Yeah. Um, I just felt it was time. Something, something spoke to me. Um, I I heard a voice clearly that said, it's time. Um, it's been 15 years since I lost my son. And since year one, I've actively been doing different things. Like we started out hosting a social media event that we did, like a family fun day in his honor. I always knew in my heart that I wanted to start a nonprofit. I just didn't have like the full structure as to what I really want to do with the nonprofit. But this year, I was like, you know what? You can plan and plan and plan, but I just heard this voice that said, it's time. It's time to get this done.

SPEAKER_00 2:47

So all right. So we come to the point of talking about your nonprofit, which wouldn't exist if it were not for your son.

Dallas’s Life And What SIDS Means

SPEAKER_00 3:01

Can you share with the audience the story of watching? Sure.

SPEAKER_01 3:07

And thank you for asking that question. Any opportunity that I get to talk about my son, I get it excited and happy because it's it's my way of allowing the world and letting the world know that he lived. So my son, Dallas, um, was born in 2011. He lived for three months and three days. He passed away uh due to SIDS, which is sudden infant death syndrome in the Caribbean. We just call it Crib debt, but it's an actual name to it. And what is SIDS? SIDS is just a name that they've given to uh this horrible situation after they've done every investigation and they just still don't have any explanation for it. You know, and it's it happens to babies um from birth to about one year old. Yes. Uh my son, for those three months and three days, full of energy, full of life. The the best three months and three days of my life. Like we have my family and I, we have so many stories within those three months and three days. It's almost like we knew he knew that he wasn't gonna be here longer. So within those, those amounts of time, that boy did everything that you could have he could have possibly done. And he just filled with love and laughter and joy. We have so many memories. But October 20th, 2011, I woke up in the morning, and um it's funny that I know he was like my alarm clock because I would take him to school. He was going to daycare at the time. He was like my alarm clock, but this morning it was like I felt like something pinched me and I jumped up out of my sleep. And I was like, he's not crying. I'm like, okay, he's still sleeping. So I was like, I'm gonna go get myself together, go jump in the shower and get, you know, because I get I have a little time to prepare myself before I got to go take care of him. So I'm in the shower, and while I'm in the shower, I could almost tell myself, I'm like, oh my god, he's up. I can hear him crying. So now I'm rushing, and I took the shower off, and I'm like, hmm, I guess I'm hearing things because he's it's quiet. So I got myself dressed and I went to get him up out of his crib. And I touched him, and I knew from the time I touched him, I knew something was wrong. Um, he just felt almost like a doll. And I was like, it didn't register, I knew something was wrong, but it it's almost like, okay, like why does he feel that way? And you know, as um as I kind of start investigating further, he started feeling heavier than usual. And um, in that moment, I knew that it it was horribly wrong after that. And I most of the time, like my memory around this moment, it it comes and goes. It's almost like there's this protective thing that I have in my head where I can tell you the stories one minute and then the next minute is almost like I I you know kind of lock it out of my head. So what happened after that? It's I can't even life just got upside down after that moment. But yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:57

Is it still appropriate to say my condolences after 15 years?

SPEAKER_01 7:06

I think so too. I I believe so. It all depends on the person, right? Um, talking about the death of a child makes people uncomfortable. It's a very taboo topic. So what whatever you felt is is in that moment you can say to to a parent, um, I guess to show that you you you acknowledge what they're going through, and then you allow that parent to say, you know what, it's it's been 15 years, that's not for me, or you say something else. So you say what you feel is appropriate, but you allow the parent to then come back and say, No, or you know what, thank you. So you have to live in that uncomfortableness in order for the education to happen. So that's my best answer to that.

SPEAKER_00 7:58

That's why I asked because before we recorded, you know, we acknowledged the grieving process and how it's often filled with platitudes and these other things to take up the space of the discomfort. Um I've learned less is more. We're having a conversation, so this is the exception to that. Less is more.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

Um less is more, and again, you know, as for me specifically, as I'm going on this journey, it's my responsibility, I feel, to help our community in how we deal with grief specifically. We know it's an uncomfortable topic, right? And we know it's an uncomfortable feeling. But in that uncomfortable feeling, in order for us to get to the other side, we have to learn to give each other grace, right? We're not always gonna say the right things. We're not always gonna acknowledge it. But this is where you allow the individual or the other person to be like, you know what, I don't really like that. But not because they're telling you they don't like that, it doesn't mean that if they're angry or upset, they're just creating their boundaries or or identifying with you how to communicate with them around the situation. So there is a level of grace that we we have to learn to give each other in this space when we're having this discussion.

Anxiety After Loss And Motherhood Choices

SPEAKER_00 9:44

All right, so let's back up a little bit. Um was Dallas your first child?

SPEAKER_01 9:50

Yes, he was my first, my one, and my only. Um, I don't have any kids after him. Uh initially, after losing him, I was like, I'm not doing this to myself. Like the I lived, so people don't talk about the byproduct of grief, right? My byproduct was anxiety to the point that I couldn't even go in a car or drive a car anymore because I I was riddled with anxiety. And for some reason, I couldn't associate me losing my son with with driving a car. Like, why is that an issue? But it was explained to me it's about losing control, right? We lose a child, it's losing control. So for me, the idea of going through that experience again for a couple of years, I was like, I don't do this. Like I'm already back, like it it takes a lot for me to mentally take care of myself. And now I'm gonna go bring another child into this world. I was like, I can't do that. So that was my first after losing him and even thinking about having kids after that. I was like, no, I'm not doing this. But in 2021, I believe, I went to the doctor and they've expressed to me, oh, you know, if you don't have if you don't make it happen now, it's not gonna happen at all. I was like, well God, what what do you mean? What do you mean I can't do it now? So I went on this journey and I remember I just came out of a really bad relationship. I didn't have anybody on my side, but I was like, you know what? Well, I gotta go make this happen. I gotta go do this. In 2021, I was like, I'm gonna start the fertility by myself and just go, you know, have a child. And then one morning I woke up and was like, girl, you're not right upstairs. Like, you have so much going on mentally. You just came out of a really bad breakup. Like, you don't, you're gonna go sit here, focus on having a child, but you're not okay. And I think it was okay for me to acknowledge with myself, like, it's okay to be in this moment and say, you know what, if I become a mom, my whole focus will be coming a mom. And then you're gonna push yourself aside, and you know that mentally you're not in a good space. So I decided I was like, you know what, I'm not doing this. And after that, I grieved for a little bit, but I focused on getting me back together. I got back into therapy. I, you know, I started working on myself. And I think I came to the realization that I'm okay if I'm not mom at this point in time. You know, I'm I'm good.

SPEAKER_02 12:46

But he was my one and only.

Caribbean Traditions And The Aftermath

SPEAKER_00 12:51

To the best extent you can, let's talk about after the the after. Um, you and I know that in the Caribbean we have I don't like to use the word ritual, but we have these cultural traditions, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:14

Around death, burial the wake and the nine night and all of these things. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

SPEAKER_00 13:24

And I've always said that it's after that.

SPEAKER_01 13:32

You need the most help.

SPEAKER_00 13:33

The real, the real work. The real work, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. For you in this particular case, because losing a child, a baby, is like it's it's everywhere. Unimaginable. Yeah. Yeah. Talk to me about how people responded to um Dallas's passing. Um and how you were dealing with their response while still trying to determine how you are feeling in this entire process.

SPEAKER_01 14:20

I must say initially, um, myself and his dad, we we had loads of support. Um, my friends, my family, they were there. I couldn't I couldn't ask for a better support system. Unfortunately, his dad and I, we did not survive that. You know, losing our son. We ultimately after that, we kind of split. Um my family, we they did, they did the whole thing. Like his funeral, up to this day, I have people coming up to me and they were like, oh, you know, I was at your son's funeral. And I'm like, how? When? Why? The church was so packed. Like people were standing outside. And I remember his grandmother, um, his his father's mom saying, like, why is there so many people for like a baby? Because the church was packed. So there was support. Like, I couldn't ask for a better support system. People were there. Um, we we did the full thing. Like, they treated it like it was an actual, you know, adult. The way how the whole we had the nine nights, we had, you know, people were there. Um the support I couldn't ask for a better support system. But, you know, after the funeral, everybody kind of went back to their lives. But for me, I had to figure out, okay, how do I function after this? So, what people don't talk about is once your child passed away with you, an actual investigation needs to happen. And you unfortunately is considered like a person of interest, so they have to investigate you. And that process took about three months, I want to say. During that process, the investigators call, the social workers call you every single day to ask you about that day. And you have to relive that moment every single day because you cannot change your story in no shape, way, or form. So I say all of that to say is I was in law, like I was lost, but I kind of had to keep myself together for three months, three. Like I, for lack of a better word, like I felt like I didn't have the space to breathe for three months because I had to mentally keep myself together because I was on the investigation. And that's a very embarrassing thing to even admit that you were at one point in time considered somebody who harmed your own child. Now I was blessed to have very good investigators and then people around me. Ultimately, they were just doing their jobs, but they knew that it wasn't anything that I did. And, you know, I'm grateful for the individuals that I had in my space. But after that, people just kind of went back to their lives and, you know, function. So support beginning, yes. But after the funeral and stuff, it's not that many people that was around. Like my friends, they did everything that in their power that they could have done to make sure that I was okay, my family. But up until that moment, I didn't know anybody who lost a child, right? Because that's not something we talk about in our families. That's a big secret. So they didn't really know what to do and how to help me. So um, I had to go looking for my own support, really and truly.

SPEAKER_02 18:34

You know.

Searching For Support That Fits

SPEAKER_00 18:36

And where did you get that support? And and how how did all of this lead to the found the nonprofit?

SPEAKER_01 18:44

Yeah. Where did I get the support? Um quite honestly, it it took a lot of work, me finding, you know, looking for support. Like oftentimes it wasn't that many support available. Um, I tried some therapy, but of course, the therapists did not look like me. They didn't understand my culture. Um, I attended some support groups, and unfortunately, those support groups were individuals that just did not look like me. Oftentimes I was the only one like me in those support groups. And again, it just felt like, why am I here? I wasn't a space that made me felt comfortable. I felt like a lot of times those spaces were created with me not in mind. And it literally took about like five years, honestly, after losing my son, for me to actually find a therapist where I felt comfortable, where I felt seen, she looked like me. And I was able to really start my healing journey. But it took, it took some time to go looking for those support. It wasn't that much available, honestly.

SPEAKER_00 20:02

You know what's interesting in what you said, everyone is talking about healthcare and mental health. And so for anyone who's like, what do you mean you couldn't find a therapist that looked like you? What do you mean that there weren't support groups that had people like you? Can you give context? Because um because mental health is you know a marquee thing we talk about, some people may not realize how things were different a few years ago, right? So could you kind of share a little bit about how you weren't able to find that? How is that how was that even possible given the plethora of options we have now?

SPEAKER_01 20:46

And even with the plethora of options, it's still not enough of us here. Uh back then, even let's talk about the death of a child, right? And doing work in maternal spaces, like that's a big thing now. And within the last couple of years, where you find that you you see a lot of organizations and even the government that's focusing a lot on like the maternal health, specifically around black women. And, you know, us, there's a large gap in how many black women we're losing, you know, around pregnancy and infancy loss, like dying, our numbers are are higher. Like the statistics show that it's really, really high. Um, but we have to take into consideration, like, these are not things that were really and truly talked about like 15 years ago. Um, I always remember, like, before me losing my son and me going to like one of those parenting classes, they talked about sits in those parenting classes, right? But it was like from uh literally in the video. Then they showed it was about like three minutes. And the individual didn't did not look like me at all. And I can tell you this, and I'll be honest to say, those things don't happen to us. That's what I said. Because the baby, the situation that was shown on camera just didn't look like us. Come to find out, now I know that we have the highest rate of SIDs in our, you know, the black and brown community have the highest rates of SIDs. The black and the brown community have the highest rates of women dying with a pregnancy-related debt and stuff like that. So these are not things that they took into consideration, the research and all of that back 15 years ago. So if those things are not taken into consideration, then the support around it of it wasn't available, or let me not say available, it wasn't available in our communities.

SPEAKER_00 22:59

You know, you said something, you know, when I had my child many years ago, many decades ago. I remember um my first child, I remember a similar situation where they talked about SIDS. And what was shocking for me was in the Caribbean, we grew up, and you put the baby on the belly to go see. Yes. And in the video, they were like, you're not supposed to do this. And in my head, I was just like, wait a minute. What? What do you mean? I grew up seeing a whole bunch of kids sleeping on their belly, right? And so it was just those little things. But as things got more sophisticated, by the time I got to my second child and my third child, they were like, you had to be careful of the certain mattresses and certain things, the co-sleeping, the cat sleep, baby, baby, bed, all the. Yes, the co-sleeping. It it was just, you know, like what we know culturally versus what the science or the best practice is saying now. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 24:04

Even calling it sids. I was like, what is cids? Not knowing all this time as crib debt. What do you mean sid? We know it as you know, crib debt.

SPEAKER_00 24:14

So which is kind of where the gap is, like our cultural norms and wording and language versus what the science is saying or what this new language is saying. So um, you know, uh back then to 2011, still sids, this little mini thing gets a little shot, and that's it. So talk to me. Yeah, right. That's it. So

Building The Dallas Lamar Project

SPEAKER_00 24:38

talk to me about your nonprofit and the work your nonprofit is doing.

SPEAKER_01 24:43

It's definitely focused on pregnancy and infancy loss. So I would have thought 15 years, right, we would have had more access. And again, there's a there's a lot of organizations out there that is doing great work within this space, but still it's nothing, it's not that many that's focused on the black and the brown community, right? And I again I started doing some research and I was like, well, I guess I gotta go build it myself. And my idea around this organization is basically building something and services and resources that I just didn't have available to me. So I was like, well, if I need it, and over the 15 years, I've had conversations with other other angel moms, uh, you know, and they talk about not having these services available to them. So I was like, well, somebody gotta do something about this, so I might as well go build it myself. So the Dallas Lamar Project was created to provide grief support therapy or peer therapy and community-centered resources for parents and families who've experienced pregnancy and infancy loss. So what we've started with in September is our first grief support uh therapy group. It's hosted once a month, the last Wednesday of every month. And what we're building towards is somewhat of a navigate, a care navigation program. And what that is, is that once they come in, the clients come in to our grief support, we then would like to connect them to a social worker or a case manager who then navigates them out to all of the services that they need. So they shouldn't have to go looking. You just experience the loss of your child. You shouldn't have to go looking for help. So you come to our organization, the intention is where you are right now. Do you think you need a therapist? You need therapy? Okay, here we are. We navigate you out to therapy. You also need maybe you're you need some medication management. You're in a space where you think you need, and that's another conversation within our community that we don't talk about. There's this whole um stigma around taking medication because you need it, right? Oh, she can't take medication because it's this big thing. So within our organization, you need to be connected to a psychiatrist for medication management. We we're we're connecting you to that. Or you're thinking about going back and have more kids. You're in a space where you want to go have more kids. We connect you to uh doula's, midwives, even a primary care doctor. So that's something that we're building, and hopefully that's gonna be launched in 2027. But for now, the main services that we're providing is the grief peer support groups.

SPEAKER_00 27:37

How much of this factors in with your with your Caribbean background and your cultural background? How much of this do you factor into the services that you you are providing? And and given your own experience within our culture, right? Like, you know, God don't give you more than you can manage. Yeah, you know, all the things, all the things, right?

SPEAKER_01 28:02

All the things. I'm taking a lot of it into consideration because again, a lot of what I'm building, I'm building it off of what I know I wanted, right? The things that I had to go looking for. I remember the first day when my son passed. I remember my family taking me to get some medication. At that point in time, I didn't know what it was, but I called them my happy pills. Um and they got me some medication, but I was an aide, they they wouldn't give it to me. My parents and my family had control of my happy pills. And I had to, I remember after you know, the funeral and stuff like that, I had to explain to my parents whenever I needed it, why I needed it. Cause it was like this because we you you really you is it really that bad? Is it really that bad that you can't sit here and you you can't get through the day? I was like, why is it that I have to explain to you guys, like I lost my son last month. Why I gotta tell you guys why I need this medication? But there's that stigma around us and grief and and needing medication and oh, let's take it to God. We're gonna go to church, go to church and pray. But also, God created therapists, right? He gave them the knowledge and the and the power to to help us to get to the other side. So I don't see why it's such a big deal to go get the proper help. So I say all of that to say is everything that we're creating is things that I know that is needed after the loss of a child specifically. Um I'm trying to break the stigma around getting the proper help, going to therapy, even being on medication. It's okay. Right? We within the Caribbean culture is very prideful and we take a lot of pride on being strong and resilient, that we can live through anything. But I also want people to understand that there's a vulnerability, that there's strength in vulnerability to say, you know what, this is just a moment. This is just a moment. It's okay for you to say, you know what, I'm not doing well. Why is it what why would I be doing well like I just lost my child? Why, why do I have to sit here and walk around thinking that I'm strong and resilient? Half of us, our moms and aunts walking around angry all the time. We don't know why they're angry, right? But also there's this big secret. Mom lost, had three miscarriages, or she did lose a baby a couple years ago, but we don't talk about it. But mom is angry and nobody wants to deal with mom much more, and mom comes home because mom's angry or why you think mom is angry? Because mom, yes, mom had five kids after the first one, but that doesn't mean that the first one that passed away didn't mean anything or it didn't make an impact on mom's life, but mom can't talk about it because mom is required to be strong and resilient, and mom don't we don't deal with those things. And I am trying to break that with this nonprofit to say we can still be strong by saying, you know what, I'm not okay.

SPEAKER_00 31:48

What

Breaking Stigma Around Therapy And Meds

SPEAKER_00 31:49

has this process taught you about how we as a culture deal with grief? And um I don't this is gonna be a it's not like a one-shot answer because this is going to evolve. It's like how we deal with grief and maybe how you approach someone who's dealing with grief, you know, um, from your perspective, you know, because not all grief is the same, it's different a parent losing a child, a child losing a parent, no matter how old, you know, just different types of grief. So can you share what have you learned?

SPEAKER_01 32:35

I think the biggest thing within our community or anybody when it comes to grief is accepting that uncomfortableness. That is the problem. Nobody wants to feel that uncomfortable feeling. It don't feel good. But once you've learned to be okay with the uncomfortableness, I think it opens the space to now start having the conversation. Because that uncomfortableness now tells us, okay, we're gonna have to figure this out. How do we talk about this? It's not gonna be right all the time. We're gonna make mistakes, but those mistakes need to happen for us to get to the other side. So for us within our community, is let's start pretending that the thing exists. It exists. Take those bones out of the closets and have the conversation. We got enough skeleton in requires. Do you know within the Caribbean and within the West Indian cultures, like we don't talk about nothing? I again, up until me losing my son, I thought I was the only one that experienced such a loss. But then as I had conversations, right, I realized my aunts had miscarriages. My grandmother lost two babies, some, you know, crib that, cousin, this body. And I'm like, but why are we not talking about this? Why is this such a big secret? Maybe if the conversations were had, at least it would have triggered me in, okay, not saying that we can um make it go away, but at least allow the awareness to happen. So you know what are the you know certain precautions that you can put into place. You know there's different things, you know, you know what to expect.

Say Their Names And Give Grace

SPEAKER_01 34:28

So you have I think surrounding grief, we have to be okay with the uncomfortableness.

SPEAKER_02 34:35

That makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 34:38

You know, as we wrap up, what do you want people to take away from your experience and from the Dallas Lamar project and what to expect?

SPEAKER_01 34:53

I want listeners, especi especially angel moms and angel dads to know that this doesn't have to be a whole story. It's just it happened and the world is not gonna end. But in order to get to the other side, you have to do the work. You have to acknowledge that it happened. Um you don't have to be strong all of the time. You know, you can admit that you need help, it's okay. Um within our community, I would like families and friends to know that it's it's okay to say their names. You know, oftentimes people say, I'm not I'm not gonna say anything about tell say say the names. You know, that's our way of knowing that the world did not forget our babies existed. And have the conversation. Have the conversation. Say, girl, you know, Dallas came like there's so many times my family call like my my aunt up to this day, she has my running joke. She can't find your shoes. Dallas, you gotta come here to find your shoes. Like, my mom, girl, this thing happened at me, grandson. Come, I said, y'all, the way y'all just blame my child for everything going missing in this house is ridiculous. But I say all of that to say is talk about that and it's okay. And if it's not okay, allow the parent to tell you so. And don't take it, don't take an offense to it. You know, take your emotions out of it, but give, live in the uncomfortableness for a second. It's okay. And with the Dallas Lamar project, we just want to provide a safe space. Um, I don't have all of the answers. I'm just building this off of what I felt I needed. But in order to do so, in order to build something of integrity, in order to build something that is effective for our community, I have to also listen. So I'm open to having conversations. You know, if you feel that there's something that I need to take into consideration, give me a call. Let's talk about it. Let's have the conversation. This organization is for our community. Um, and in order to build something for our community, you have to be open to listening to.

SPEAKER_00 37:27

Yeah. There is something else that um I want to add. You didn't quite say it, but as I listened to you, um, you said that family members, friends, whoever, you know, um will take cues from the grieving parent, right? How to handle that. But you said something in the beginning that that grief evolves. And so how you responded maybe the first week after, the first month or two after will change. And so it's not like, oh, I'm not talking to she because she balls off of me, because the baby's done that. I'm not talking to her because she came about. Don't ask me, not don't talk to me. Don't yet don't take it person. I mean, we're laughing about it, but it's serious, like it's not personal. You are still processing your grief and trying to come to an understanding of who you are as you're going through that process. And as you go through that process, you are also changing. So, you know, you said It's not leak. It's not leaking. Exactly. And the word you said, give grace, right? In that process. So important. Yes. I wanted to make sure I capture what I've heard you say through this process. Um yeah, because you said it, I'm a mom, and I just I felt it, and you know, I asked, what is it appropriate to still say that? Um I'm okay if you were like, don't however way you responded, I'd be like, okay. You know, right.

SPEAKER_01 39:13

We can't take it personal because and I think that's that's another thing too within our community. We take everything so personal. Like, me and talking to Shinoma because she yelled up at me. Do you know what my day was like? Do you know? Like, I woke up that morning today. For example, my son, uh, October 20th is when my son passed. So I woke up okay that day, but I was quiet. I still had to go on with my meetings and doing this, da da da da da da da, but I possibly wasn't in the best of moods, you know? And my I remember my partner saying, babe, what's what, because not everybody sometimes takes account for the days, right? So he was like, Oh, you're snappy with me. Yeah, I am. And then he was like, wait a minute. He said, Okay, I understand. So you you have to stop taking everything so personal. It's not personal to you. You're not the only one existing today. People got things going on.

October Awareness And How To Connect

SPEAKER_00 40:16

Thank you so much for being on the podcast and sharing your story. And um, I hope that someone listening can share it with someone else in their network, their circle, their community who has dealt with this or knows someone who is still dealing with this. Um this is not, you know, one of the things that I found when I had my grief around my my father or my grandparents is that you begin to try to find your people. This the people who are going through the same exact grief you're going through. And I'm I'm I'm glad that you've created this opportunity for, you know, women, people, you know, women of color, but specifically Caribbean women and Caribbean parents to find their people who understand, you know, what it's like going through this type of grief. Yeah. This type of loss, actually.

SPEAKER_01 41:15

So and this this conversation is not, I'm sorry, this conversation is so important in the month of October because October is pregnancy and infancy loss month. October 15th is pregnancy and infancy loss remembrance day. So this conversation is a good time to have it.

SPEAKER_00 41:33

Yes. Why don't you tell the community where they could find you online and how they could connect?

SPEAKER_01 41:41

Sure. So you guys can follow us on Facebook and Instagram at the Dallas Lamar Project. You can check out our website at Dallas Lamar Project.org. You could send us an email at info at the Dallas Lamar Project. On those platforms, you can find access to our um schedule. And as I mentioned, we have our peer support groups once a month. The last Wednesday of every month, it's in person. So you guys can actually come and be in person with us. Uh, it's this Wednesday, uh, October 28th, and it's in BedSty, so you guys can come share the flyers. Uh, it's also important, you know, you can go on our website, you can donate to us because a lot of times this is nonprofit and it's community work, but it also takes financial resources to do the community work as well. So donate to us and you know, reach out to us if you have any other conversations or questions that you may think that we need to consider as we continue building this organization.

SPEAKER_00 42:52

Wonderful. Thank you so much for being on the show today. And as I love to say at the end of every episode, walk good.

SPEAKER_01 43:02

Thank you very, very much. I appreciate you giving me the and sharing this platform with me.